Author Topic: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger  (Read 13237 times)

Offline lklawson

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CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« on: January 24, 2012, 09:20:02 AM »
New for me this year: CZ-70

The DA on it is horrible.  I've polished the hammer strut and worked the inside of the hammer spring, and polished the firing pin block and its fit/hole in the slide.  Not to a mirror finish, but smooth; when I draw my fingernail over it, I can feel no roughness or dragging.  It did help a smidge but not near enough.  I'm not quite brave enough to tear out the sear or the trigger bar to polish them.  I've read of one gent who replaced the hammer spring and the firing pin lock spring with lighter ones from Wolff and had good results.  Those are only $20 (+S&H) so I might try that.  They both seem particularly stiff to me.

If I can get the trigger weight down to "normal human" range and still be reliable, I will bling up the grips.  I'm thinking "white pearl" or "imitation ivory."

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Kirk
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Offline b5.5dan

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2012, 10:45:48 PM »
I'm sorry to hear that you are hating it so much... What was that pistol's role? Was it a service arm? Was the stiff trigger a safety measure? Maybe fingers were just stronger in Czechoslovakia!  :laugh: We need to do more to strengthen our weak digits...


Anyway, I hear so many things about Wolff products. I would like to do all four of my CZs in their stuff...

Offline lklawson

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2012, 11:07:41 PM »
I'm sorry to hear that you are hating it so much...
Well, I hate the trigger, not the gun.  I don't know if I hate the gun yet.  There've been too many people who talk about how the trigger was "OK" to start with and then they improved it.  this makes me think that my trigger is out of the norm and can be significantly improved.

Quote
What was that pistol's role? Was it a service arm? Was the stiff trigger a safety measure? Maybe fingers were just stronger in Czechoslovakia!  :laugh: We need to do more to strengthen our weak digits...
The '50 was a military service sidearm and a police service arm.  The '70 (a slightly revamped version of the '50) was intended for police and civilian export market.  I really think that my example is unusually heavy and can be improved a whole lot.  I'm really thinking the firing pin lock spring.

Quote
Anyway, I hear so many things about Wolff products. I would like to do all four of my CZs in their stuff...
I've been pleased with the items that I've bought from them.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
The Cheapskate's Guide to Gun Cleaning and Maintenance - "You shouldn't have to spend thousands of dollars on expensive gun cleaning an maintenance products." - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kirk-lawson/the-cheapskates-guide-to-gun-cleaning-and-maintenance/ebook/product-21444457.html

Offline Kevin J

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2012, 11:19:27 PM »
The CZ70 looks like the love child of the CZ52 and the 82.

It's pretty neat to see the the transitions in models over time.

Offline lklawson

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2012, 09:34:52 AM »
Well, I worked with it a little more and now I've changed my mind about the cause.  I don't think it's the Firing Pin Lock Spring any more.  Either the Hammer Spring is much stronger than I realized or there is another issue in the linkage.  Perhaps the Hammer Strut got misaligned somehow when I reinstalled it (but I really doubt that because the DA/SA both still function fine, just really heavy) or some bit of detritus got into the linkage as I was working on it.

I still want to replace the Firing Pin Lock Spring, of course, but the Hammer Spring is taking a higher priority than I'd thought.  And I may have to bite the bullet, take my fate in my own hands, cast fortune to the winds, and man-up & pull out the entire trigger system for a cleaning and light polish.   :P

I haven't even shot the thing yet.  I just want a DA that I don't have to use both fingers for and a SA that feels less than 10 lbs.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
The Cheapskate's Guide to Gun Cleaning and Maintenance - "You shouldn't have to spend thousands of dollars on expensive gun cleaning an maintenance products." - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kirk-lawson/the-cheapskates-guide-to-gun-cleaning-and-maintenance/ebook/product-21444457.html

Offline lklawson

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2012, 04:29:04 PM »
I had a Dr. appt in the early AM so I decided to take the whole morning off and get down to the range.  I needed to 1) Sight in a laser on my PF9 2) test out the chambers I polished on a IJ 22SUPERSHOT 3) Break in a brand new NEOS 3) test the function of my new-to-me CZ-70

I knew I'd be spending the majority of the time just running rounds through the NEOS so I only took the three mags I had for the CZ-70 pre-loaded.

Well, 24 perfect rounds of Fiocchi and I am duly impressed.  3 targets at 21".  Took me 1 target to get the feel for the gun but all the rounds stayed on paper.  After that I was plugging all rounds in the black.  Wow.  If I were to spend any quality time with this gun I could probably teach it to tear a ragged hole in the bull.

I only fired in SA.  It has a ton of slack but draws decent enough after that is taken up even if it is pretty heavy.  I don't know why people complain about the recoil.  It was a lot lighter recoiling than a Makarov and downright pleasant compared to the PF9 which preceded it in my hands.

I officially like this gun.  Now if only I can tame that abysmal trigger weight!

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
The Cheapskate's Guide to Gun Cleaning and Maintenance - "You shouldn't have to spend thousands of dollars on expensive gun cleaning an maintenance products." - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kirk-lawson/the-cheapskates-guide-to-gun-cleaning-and-maintenance/ebook/product-21444457.html

Offline GhostWarrior

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2012, 05:51:57 PM »
         Like I need another CZ or VZ (same thing more or less for those that don't know) you are making me think about a 70. I have the 52 and 82, didn't really think about the 70 and the other one the 50? I suppose I could round out the collection with those. Love to know how you overcome the trigger pull when you have  Kirk.
       
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Offline lklawson

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2012, 08:33:47 PM »
Yeah.  I'm really digg'n it.  I think I'll have to replace the Hammer Spring with something lighter.

Here are some comparison pics:



Kel Tec P32, RADOM P64, CZ-70


CZ-70 and P64


Makarov and CZ-70


CZ-70 and Makarov from top


Makarov and CZ-70 from heel


CZ-70 and Kel-Tec P11


Kel-Tec PF9 and CZ-70

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
The Cheapskate's Guide to Gun Cleaning and Maintenance - "You shouldn't have to spend thousands of dollars on expensive gun cleaning an maintenance products." - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kirk-lawson/the-cheapskates-guide-to-gun-cleaning-and-maintenance/ebook/product-21444457.html

Offline lklawson

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2012, 10:47:22 AM »
I scavenged a spring from an empty butane lighter which has a lighter compression strength than the stock Firing Pin Lock Spring (part #8) and it does, indeed, make the SA a bit lighter pull.  The DA is still too heavy.  Have to replace the Hammer Spring.  And the draw is still pretty gritty but I think I'll probably just live with it.  :)

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
The Cheapskate's Guide to Gun Cleaning and Maintenance - "You shouldn't have to spend thousands of dollars on expensive gun cleaning an maintenance products." - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kirk-lawson/the-cheapskates-guide-to-gun-cleaning-and-maintenance/ebook/product-21444457.html

Offline lklawson

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2012, 11:22:27 AM »
A gent on the P64 forum was asking some questions about comparisons between the P64 and the CZ-70 so I took some pics and some quick measurements and posted them there.  Figured I'd post 'em here too.

  My caliper measures the CZ-70 at 0.873" and the P64 at 0.827".

In comparison, the Kel Tec PF9 is officially 0.88"/22mm.







Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
The Cheapskate's Guide to Gun Cleaning and Maintenance - "You shouldn't have to spend thousands of dollars on expensive gun cleaning an maintenance products." - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kirk-lawson/the-cheapskates-guide-to-gun-cleaning-and-maintenance/ebook/product-21444457.html

Offline GhostWarrior

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2012, 03:55:40 PM »
       Nice work Kirk! I'm thinking of doing a side by side comparison of all my pistols using the Pre-B as the base weapon and putting all the others up against it. I like the way you did yours I may do it that way, shows the differences better. NO idea where I'll post it, most likely in the General Firearms Board.
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Offline lklawson

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2012, 10:20:39 AM »
I think that's a great idea.

I also really liked the way "Mousegunner" (God rest his soul) did his mouse-gun chart.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
The Cheapskate's Guide to Gun Cleaning and Maintenance - "You shouldn't have to spend thousands of dollars on expensive gun cleaning an maintenance products." - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kirk-lawson/the-cheapskates-guide-to-gun-cleaning-and-maintenance/ebook/product-21444457.html

Offline GhostWarrior

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2012, 11:38:28 AM »
         Can't say as I remember ever seeing that chart. Do you have a copy or a link of/for it that you could send me? I had no idea Mouse Passed, very sorry for his loss.
         I think posting his chart here with a pasty so it dosen't ever get buried would be a nice way to honor him?
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Offline lklawson

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2012, 08:43:54 PM »
Sure thing.

http://mouseguns.com/PocketAutoComparison.pdf

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
The Cheapskate's Guide to Gun Cleaning and Maintenance - "You shouldn't have to spend thousands of dollars on expensive gun cleaning an maintenance products." - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kirk-lawson/the-cheapskates-guide-to-gun-cleaning-and-maintenance/ebook/product-21444457.html

Offline GhostWarrior

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Re: CZ-70's infamous DA trigger
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2012, 10:29:14 AM »
         Thank you very much for that link. It's Amazing the work he had to put into that chart. I have never seen it before but I wish I had before he passed so I could tell him now Shiny that chart is and thank him for doing it. The world lost a really good person that day.  :sad:
 
         That link is going up as a Sticky, and if I can do it. I will put the actual chart up the same way so that there is less chance that it ever goes away. Things like that are way to important and valuable to take a chance on losing.
If at first you don't succeed, then Skydiving is not your sport.

Welcome Home every Veteran and active Service personnel and Thank you from the bottom of my heart for your sacrifice